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Poetic and Heroic music
I recently, after reading some posts by Edna Stern on this site, got her Schumann cd which is not so simple to do here in the US (hence my reference to the french amazon). I'll first give it a plug by saying it is an amazing cd and everyone who likes Schumann should get it. The origin of this post is her version of his Fantasy which is simply one of the best versions ever recorded. 
To get to the point of this post, I compared it with the masterful version of Claudio Arrau and was struck by the difference. Arrau's playing could be described as so much more masculine than Stern's which seems an extremely feminine version all of a sudden. But, I don't think masculine and feminine is the right distinction here. As you might have guessed from the title I want to distinguish two different kinds of piano playing, and music in general. One is the heroic, the other is the poetic. Arrau is clearly the heroic piano player - you simply can't be more heroic than him, while Stern is clearly the poetic.

Some examples then: I would say the Dinu Lipatti is perhaps the most poetic of piano players, while Richter and Arrau are extremely heroic, as is Ferruccio Busoni (from the one amazing disc by him I heard). But that you don't think it is technical gymnastics I'm talking about, though , I'd say that Cziffra, one of the most technically impressive pianist of this century, is also one of the most poetic of pianists.
I'm sure many would disagree with my description of these pianists but the point is more whether you agree with the distinction and not the specific names and what category they belong to.

But then not all pianists are divided by this category. I would tend to put Rachmaninov, who I consider the best pianist of the century, as heroic, but pianists like Rubinstein and maybe even Gilels I'm not sure about (I haven''t listened to them recently enough).
(And so you don't think women fall into the category of the poetic, I wouldn't consider Clara Haskill, Myra Hess, nor Argerich as poetic pianists).
Similarly as not all literature is either heroic or poetic but these are simply two kinds of literature I would say the same for pianists, and musicians in general.

The other point I wanted to make is how the performer creates the music as heroic or as poetic music. When hearing the fantasy played by Stern it is poetic, while by Arrau it is heroic. So can we say about (classical music) pieces whether they are heroic or poetic? Or can we simply speak of performers?
Music Discussed
Schumann: Piano Works

I'm sorry, my english is ver very... bad.

Edna Stern's fantasy reminds me of Yves Nat. Poetic.
I don't like "heroic music", I prefer poetic music. Schumann was a poet before being a musician.
 Before singing, a musician (pianist) must know how to speak (I think Kempff, the better narrator. A good poetry needs good narration).
Yves Nat said : "le piano n'est pas un moyen d'avoir des moyens, mais un moyen d'expression" (trans google : " the piano is not a way to have means but a means of expression"

Sorry for my english.

En français :

J'ai découvert Edna Stern grâce à Schumann. Son interprétation de la fantaisie m'a beaucoup fait penser à celle d'Yves Nat, exemple parfait de poésie, même plus, de vie (humanité).
Je ne suis pas franchement attirée par les interprétations "héroïques". Schumann avant d'être musicien était poète. Et je pense que comme beaucoup de compositeurs, Beethoven, Schubert, Haydn... (Pour en citer peu), Schumann demande une narration irréprochable. C'est ce qui m'a marqué ces derniers temps dans les sonates de Beethoven, Kempff les met à notre portée grâce à une incroyable lisibilité, une très grande clarté (supérieure à celle de Nat encore je trouve).
Yves Nat disait "le piano n'est pas un moyen d'avoir des moyens, mais un moyen d'expression". C'est la première phrase qui me vint en tête en écoutant la Fantaisie d'Edna Stern pour la première fois, c'est ce que j'aime retrouver lorsque j'écoute la musique.

Il est pour moi impossible d'apprécier une oeuvre si à la base, le discours n'est pas clairement énoncé. Hélàs, ce n'est pas toujours le cas. J'ai l'impression que certains musiciens se lancent dans l'héroïsme, mettent beaucoup de moyens, mais en oubliant de passer par l'essentiel.
Hi Mylène,
I liked how you answered both in English and in French. I think many of the people here can at least read french reasonably fluently, but as many can't I also think it was nice, and important, how you gave them a synopsis of what you say so they can follow the discussion.

As for Yves Nat, I completely agree, and would also call him a poetic pianist.
But funny you mention Yves Nat - I just listened to Cziffra play the Waldstein and the Appassionata, and it was a masterful interpretation. The pianist he most reminded me of was Yves Nat. Until now I found Yves Nat completely unique in his interpretation of Beethoven, but Cziffra is in some ways very similar. I haven't listned to Nat for a while but even their technique seems somewhat similar to me.
I was wondering if you knew his interpretation and what you thought of it?

Regarding the heroic pianists, I agree with you that the pianists of today think that simply having some amazing digital technique, and banging on the piano, makes their interpretation heroic. Many of them are empty technique, which is exactly the kind of pianists who Schumann complained about as they also ruled the scene in his time too. But the fact that these pianists mistake their empty technical playing and heroicism shouldn't be held against the great heroic pianists. There are also plenty of bad poetic pianists, only we wouldn't call them poetic, but many of their fans would.

In response to John Stevenson
Hi again John, I only know Cziffra through his Liszt interpretations which are amazing, but I never heard him in Beethoven sonatas. I'm very curious so am trying to find the CD now. Thanks for telling me about it.
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