THINQon : Subconscious Irony?

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Gregory Ixotl

Subconscious Irony?

Latest Post: March 20, 2011 at 1:18 PM

11 followers

On the metro a young friend told me of his dream about lips cracked like mud. I tried to explain to him (in Russian, which didn't help) I heard a dream researcher say that those about broken teeth and teeth falling out may have a biological origin since they seem to be universal among all subjects. I have them often myself. So perhaps he didn't need to worry about deep-seeded complexes. . .Later, I was catching up with old New Yorkers, reading Margret Talbot's "Nightmare Scenario" (16-11-09, 43-51), which focuses on the "Maimonides Sleep Arts&Sciences" clinic in Alburquerque founded not by Italo Calvino, but the dream researcher Barry Krakow. He's developed a therapy for nightmares where patients develop lucid dreaming to work themselves out of what he calls a 'dream rut' where recurring nightmares are not just a symptom but an aggravating factor.
I dreamt that night that I was in the dock of a space ship before brilliantly white instrument panels. There was also a brilliantly white model of my own teeth set into the instrument panel, though expanded to about a metre across. I carefully removed some of the teeth with my white gloves in my white suit and cape. . .
It was quite clear that my subconscious was making a joke at my (!) expense. Let us count the ways:
1) I told my friend these were merely biological and represented nothing sophisticated, had no extra meaning.
2) I hate the feature of science fiction that it invents machines which solve all the problems of the plot.
3) I find tooth-whitening technology excessively vain.
There's some background to the joke, too. I developed lucid dreaming as a teen-ager, but gave it up when the dreams became boring. . . other things, too, not worth expanding upon.
So how can your subconscious make a joke if it is not a complete self and conscious?
Jung, where I can't recall, wrote of humour in the subconscious. One of his patients, excessively vain and self-important, said she dreamt someone ushered her into a room saying, "all your friends are here!" The room was a cowshed. But the patient herself didn't understand the dream.
In this case the subconscious is taking the piss out of me and commenting on itself.
It's a kind of vexing turn, isn't it?
Only an abstract of the NYer piece, unfortunately:
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2009/11/16/091116fa_fact_talbot

Krakow has been compiling an online "dreambank" of 16,000 entries, but I cannot find it at present.

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john hagan

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john hagan

November 7, 2010 at 6:03 AM

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Reality, dreams 'truth' and consciousness.

If you say I had a dream about your teeth and it meant x,y,z... is that true ?

If you pick up a book which 'explains' dreams, how do you know that is what that dream meant for you (perhaps it meant nothing ?). Perhaps you would not have 'understood it' if some 'expert' had not 'interpretated' it or suggested a explanation ? Are these mere conditionings being implanted in your brain ? Or are they 'real' ?

If I talk to someone and they say; “I'm a schizophrenic, manic depressive, bipolar, with a,b,c tendencies...” How do they know that ? Where did they learn those labels and language from ?

Isn't Cognitive Psychology better than Freudian Regression ?

Isn't re-languaging and NLP better for giving a positive spin and outlook on the world ?

Why suggest to a person that they have 'problems' just because the Medical Community don't really know what they are talking about in relation to the brain, identity etc. ?

You wouldn't go along to a best mate and say something to make them feel worse would you ?

Isn't it better to 'interpret' all these 'dreams' positively and thus make the person happier ?

Why would you want to give a negative view that only promulgates angst, fear or worry ?

(That isn't to say you couldn't interpret something as a warning... but as a good, positive warning).

“So how can your subconscious make a joke if it is not a complete self and conscious?”

The subconscious is often described as being very powerful, but very dumb. It's like the computer acronym G.I.G.O. (garbage in, garbage out). The subconscious is trying to sort all the stuff out, if you have had a problem that day, the subconscious doesn't 'think' about it, it merely tries to connect it, or file it, with something similar. So you can awake and say Eureka ! Likewise making a joke. If you watch, read, talk to funny people, your thinking will become more orientated that way, your capacity to tell jokes, be witty, will be greater. Your subconscious will 'make' more jokes.

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Arthur Mont

November 7, 2010 at 1:23 PM

72 followers

Great story Gregory!
But is it our subconscious which laughs at us or our consciousness? You tell of your dream which made a joke at your expense, but if your character, your conscious character, wouldn't be of a kind who laughs at him or herself would that still be possible? Your Jung example is especially interesting here as could it have only been her subconscious laughing at her, or was she secretly laughing at herself also in her conscious life?

It seems to me that one's character would have to be self-critical and of a humoristic nature for one's subconscious to play jokes on oneself. This character would then also appear in one's consciousness and not only in one's subconscious (lucky firefox has a spell checker with all of these s's). No?

(Another example of subconscious irony are faulty words we sometimes mistakenly say, which Freud was fond of.)

One of the reasons I really liked your post is that it's always interesting to discover new places where humor could appear, such as the discussion on What is a musical joke? and Edna's brilliant post there. Maybe jokes have descended to our subconscious and our music?

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ted berryman

November 9, 2010 at 1:33 AM

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I guess it’s not too surprising. Conscious acts within the subconscious mirrors the structure of irony, having its differential between surface and underlying meaning. That may go a long ways in explaining why irony is so powerful.