Andrew, With respect, I think you generalise. I am no fan of the RC church as a whole, nor of most other Christian churches for that matter, but it isn't all bad. For example, what about the RC Jesuits who have fought hard, working and preaching against successive governments and landowners in El Salvador because of the poverty they inflict on people? Several of them have been murdered for doing this, such as Archbishop Romero or the six priests (and their housekeeper with daughter) at the University of Central America, and the four nuns at Maryknoll? As I recall, several S American Jesuits have been criticised by Rome for having been too political! The RC church in Poland, often criticised for its anti-abortion stance, arguably fulfilled a similar role to the Jesuits but in Poland during the 1980s, with priests preaching against Martial Law and the so-called Communist government, backing for the Solidarity movement, resulting in the extra-judicial killing of the priest Jerzy Popieluszko by the Polish secret police. The RC Church and Solidarity were so interlinked that the Church in Nova Huta had a chapel(?) dedicated to Solidarity along side those for the saints. (May still be there. I visited Poland in 1982. Amazing experience, with the smell of revolution in the air.)
" I think you generalise. I am no fan of the RC
church as a whole, nor of most other Christian churches for that matter,
but it isn't all bad."
Nowhere did I say that the church is all bad. Just that the pedophilia scandal went all the way to the highest levels, indicating a significant level of inhumanity and rot at the Vatican and elsewhere in the church organization. There is a huge difference.
"or example, what about the RC Jesuits who have fought hard, working and
preaching against successive governments and landowners in El Salvador
because of the poverty they inflict on people?"
I imagine we're coming from different perspectives. I see the church as unnecessary and redundant - all the examples you listed could have been done without it. If the church weren't there, people could have organized something else - like here in the U.S. we have the ACLU and NAACP, both secular organizations. Surely individual members of all religious traditions are sometimes admirable, heroes even. Once again, this has nothing to do with my argument. My problem concerns the centralized power of the Vatican, the hypocrisy of an organization claiming to be the one true church, and their backward views on so many, many, issues. No number of admirable Catholic people takes away from my point... It's about their leadership and organization.
Probably the most admirable people in the church are actively fighting the Vatican on a few issues, or have at least earned its enmity - like the American nuns it launched an investigation into in the last two years or so.
And for every example of something positive the church or its members have done I can give you a negative - it's too easy. But the negatives carry more weight, I think. After all, this is the one true church, inspired by god, led by an infallible pope, the only correct representative of the religion that is the only way to salvation.... and on and on. Shouldn't they be batting a thousand, by their own standards?
If the church organization could not even accomplish (and in some cases actively obstructed) the most basic act of humanity in this case - protecting innocent children - why should I give them the benefit of the doubt in any other?
Anyway, my original statement was about the separation of church and state. I wish the Supreme Court had a little more clarity on that issue - prop 8 is about to come in front of it in the next few years, and I know four catholics who are going to follow church doctrine and rule that discrimination is just fine. The question is what the fifth catholic will do (and whether he'll get excommunicated for it...).
