THINQon : What is specifically personal?

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Arthur Mont

What is specifically personal?

Latest Post: May 16, 2009 at 6:06 AM

72 followers

I was struck lately by the importance, for some, of being related to personally. A quick example is the discussion on Is sex personal but people even seem to be concerned whether a Raven looks at them in a personal matter (see How to tell if a Raven lies ). I commented in Unnecessary when I personally care about it, which is pretty much only in a relationship - I care that who I'm with is with me and not with "my boyfriend" or "a man."
To bring in gender, I think this phenomena is more prevalent among women. The social reasoning behind it seem to me not too interesting at the moment, but I do want to understand why do people care so much. Personally, I don't know if people I interact with, interact with me on a personal level, even my best friends, or as a sort of thing in the world. I must admit - I just don't get it. I don't get why people care about being reacted to personally, with regards their uniqueness.
On the other hand, as mentioned in my response in unnecessary, to be reacted to as a human being, as a person not simply as an object in their world, is something I find crucial and which should always be demanded (and needs to be as others forget).

When I read a book, the author didn't write it for me, but I still get a lot out of it. I feel addressed, and I feel personally addressed to an extent, by it, even if it was written thousands of years ago by a very different culture and person. Similarly when talking to people I care that what they say is meaningful to me, not whether they really are talking to all my particularities. I would add that I very much care that they care about me if they're my friends. Whether they care because of something inherently personal about me? I just don't understand why would anybody care about that.

But now, there is a game to be played here. If, for instance, someone would talk to me, and I would see them saying exactly the same thing to anybody they talked to, I would move to pay less attention to them as I wouldn't feel having been addressed at all. One needs to feel it is also at you, with some particularity.
Also, I actually care that I feel I am talking to real people here, that if I talk to Gregory, or Layla, or Mia, that there is a person there. A person I'm in some way connecting to. I am not talking into space but to particular people, but then my address is to everybody. When I say something I note that it will be more generally valid and helpful and not only to the specific person I'm answering. We are building an encyclopedia here don't forget. But also in the world, when you speak to someone you are speaking not only to their present but their past and future which is very vague, and thus the address is to something much more general.

When a mother loves her kid - does she love them with their uniqueness, or does she simply love her child. I would say the second is the case. As an example I can say that a few years ago I showed my parents a passport photograph of me and they couldn't decide whether it was me or my brother, though we look nothing alike and they looked at it for a while. We have so much become identical to them as to be indistinguishable - not in what they think of us, but with how they love us. There is really nothing personal in this love almost.

In any case, I hope this elaboration is enough to start a discussion, which I hope can elucidate the point to me. Because, to be perfectly frank, I am not at all sure of my position, and feel very uneasy with it. Maybe I do care? Everything I said here I might take back. I delayed writing this post for a while because I don't really feel sure about anything I'm saying here but I think it is important enough to raise the question.

This post is referenced by the following other contributors:

Arthur Mont	in "Animals / Do animals have rhythm? / How to tell if a Raven Lies"	(Safari & Garden)
Molly Bloom	in "Simone De Beauvoir: The Second Sex / The Second Sex: Chapter 1, second half"	(Library)

Reply to:

Layla Tov

May 10, 2009 at 8:37 PM

11 followers

Dear Arthur, you say you are not sure of your opinion on the question you ask, and I'll say that I'm not sure if I understand the question at all. Nevertheless, when you say that women care more about this, it does sound true. I'll try to exemplify.
First of all, you say you care about being addressed to for your uniqueness only in a love relationship. I don't see what's different with friends: if I can go out with friend A or friend B, I usually have specific different reasons to ask either of them out, and I would expect a totally different experience in going out with either of them. It could be that I don't care too much and just want to go out with "a" good friend, but the chosen friend will expect to be reacted to by me in a personal way. It is true that personal does not imply unique: I may relate to A and B in a very similar way, I may ask exactly the same questions formulated in the same way. They may react exactly the same. But at some point they will differ and the two parallel stories will take separate ways. This reminds me of a tv show from the 80s: there's a woman on the left of the stage, a wall in the middle of the stage, three men on the right part of the stage. The men and the woman cannot see each other. The woman asks the men the same questions, hears the answers and chooses her favourite answer to each question. At the end she goes on a holiday with the man who gave most of her favourite answers. She definitely doesn't choose him for his uniqueness (it's an elimination process, not very flattering I'd say!) but she does choose him for something personal and different from the other two.
The question of uniqueness is (maybe) separate. Women may care about it more than men, at least in a love relationship. To a woman it might be a question of being THE princess, the best possible choice, THE exact other half (for sociological reasons I too don't care to discuss now). It's a very reassuring thought, that there is exactly one right choice, and you've made it. I find it a very natural fantasy. Admitting that there could be other equally right choices requires more self-assurance.
Another thought on uniqueness: I have no siblings and this makes it very, very difficult for me to understand that someone (my parents) could love me as much as they love someone else. I really don't get it. This probably influences my expectation of being treated as unique.
What you say about the author of a book not writing specifically to you, is a very good point. I don't think any of us is disappointed about it (though with very good books and living writers one may be tempted to contact the author and tell him what his book as done for you) or jealous of the person the book is dedicated to. So in this case we are ready to join the community of the readers and give up our uniqueness. But then there's no emotional connection with the author. He is more of an abstract concept than a person. You wouldn't care to impress him/it with your uniqueness (again, you may fantasize about it in your spare time, but that's not the point).
Summing up: I think that caring about the personal/uniqueness is only relative to real emotional relationships between people. And I do think that everybody wants to be loved for what they are (personal), not necessarily for all what they are and all what they aren't (siblings). Makes sense?

Reply to: or

Arthur Mont

May 16, 2009 at 6:06 AM

72 followers

Hi Layla,
Everyone deals with everyone on some level of uniqueness, for instance simply by using your name. (I'll mention that also the non-uniqueness of names bothers women more, which brings about a lot of strange spellings). And obviously I prefer my friends to relate to me uniquely. For example, if I would feel a friend of mine behaving to me exactly as to any other stranger I dout we would continue to be friends for much longer.
So yes, there is always some uniqueness. But how far does it go?

Your teacher treats you somewhat personally, that is they would relate differently to a monkey, and differently to an alien, and differently to someone not from their class maybe. But do they relate to you differently than any other of their students? They know you are a woman, that's already some detail, and there are more. But obviously it is not, usually, a really personal relationship. This bothers some students tremendously. It is not that they don't care about you.

The question here is not about quality then but quantity - how personal is their relationship? How much of you do they relate to?
They always relate uniquely to some part of you and to some not at all and the measure is what matters. But you might want a measure which is rare. My question again would be: What do you care? Why care?

I don't think I managed to explain myself well at all, so please ask whatever you don't understand. Of course, I don't understand myself, which is why I brought up the topic, and so it is hard for me to explain.

I do think you mentioning being a unique child is important, though probably most first-born feel similarly to you (I am a second child). Perhaps that's also why other students of my adviser never bothered me. This topic also connects nicely to the question of Monogamy .